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[kanchi_dasa]

Dear AC-ji and Anbu-ji,

I had this thought just a few hours ago. Anusha-ji mentioned that the Kaamika Agama mentions Manipura and Svadishtana as abodes of fire and water respectively while Bhagavadpada declares the reverse. If aggressive fire is the energy of Rudra and the cooling waters are the energies of Shakti, there are two cases. One is when Shri Parameshvara as fire does Samhara and those destructive flames are quelled by the compassionate disposition of Shakti. This case, we have already seen.

Another is when Parashakti is as destructive water and this force of water is controlled by the fire of Rudra (Saguna Parameshvara) which has the capacity to dry it up. Surprising! Fire alone is not involved in Samhara Karya. Recently, Shri Anbu-ji mentioned the word, 'Samvarta'. It means not only Pralaya Kala fire, but also implies clouds filled with nothing but water. These samvarta clouds cause widespread destruction by heavy rains and floods.

Shri Parameshvara in his boundless compassion dries up the waters of Pralaya through his fiery power. The reason Adi Shankara wrote differently is that he wanted to show Shakti-mahimna as that is the very purpose of Soundarya Lahari. What better way can there be than to say that She utterly extinguished the prowess of her Pati, the Lord of the three worlds!!!

Kaamika Agama as previously mentioned in this thread (please go to www.shaivam.org ... focuses on Lord Siva as the bestower of grace, as Sadasiva, as the compassionate Anugraha Moorthy. Hence, it wants to portray Lord Siva as the merciful Lord and thus speaks differently. This is just my thought.

By the way, it does not matter really if fire and water are switched places. This is because both are generators of each other. In the Upanishads, water is the child of fire. In the Rig Veda, fire is known as Apam Napat, the child of water. Thus in reality, both are two different manifestations of the same principle.

With Ever Warmest Regards,
Kanchi Dasa

_________________
NAMAH SHIVAYA-JAYA JAYA SHANKARA-HARA HARA SHANKARA

[naathigan]

Let me add to the confusion.
Acording to Sakta Sastra, each of the 7 cakras (including Sahasraram) are represented by one Yogini. Lalita Sahasra

Namam from 475-534 gives the name of each yogini along with their Rupam, Color, facets, weapons, gunas, Parivara

Devatas, Datu, food they like, number of petals in the cakra and aksharas they represent. This is given in the order

of panca bhutas and this is same as the number of faces that each Yogini has. It startss with Visuddhi and ends

with Muladhara. In this case Manipuraka corresponds to Agni as mentioned by Sri anushachennai.

The number of faces are same as the element order which each cakra represent. For example Vayu is derived from

Akasa and so Yogini representing this element will have 2 faces. So here is the order

Visuddhi - Akasa tatvam, Yogini is dAkineswari, 1 face
Anahatam - Vayu tatvam, Yogini is rAkini, 2 faces
Manipuram - Agni tatvam, Yogini is lAkini, 3 faces
Swadhishtanam - Ap tatvam, Yogini is kAkini, 4 faces
Muladharam - Prthvi tatvam, Yogini is sAkini, 5 faces,
Ajna - Manas tatvam, Yogini is hAkini, 6 faces
Sahasraram - Yogini is yAkini, countless faces


So which is true? Is it Bhagavatpada or sahasranama which was composed by vasinyAdi (Vasini and other 7 )

devatas as commanded by Lalita devi herself? Even Bhaskararaya has not commented on this discrepency with

Soundaryalahari.

My take is that Bhagavatpada is correct as he says this very explicitly whereas we have to infer this from

Sahasranama. Also Bhagavadpada reiterates the association of Agni to Swadishtana in sloka 39 of SL.

तव स्वाधिश्ठाने हुतवहम् अधिष्ठाय निरतम्
तमीडे सम्वर्तम् जननि महतीम् ताम् च समयाम्
यदा लोकॆ लोकान् दहति महसि क्रोधकलितॆ
दयाद्रा या द्र्ष्टिः शिशिरम् उपचारम् रचयति

[kanchi_dasa]

Dear Naathigan-ji,

You are not adding 2 the confusion, but rather clarifying this issue. The additional quote from Soundarya Lahari was very useful. However, you mentioned that Lalita Sahasranama says otherwise and that we have to infer from it. Which namas tell this? Can you tell me where in LS this info is found?

With Ever Warmest Regards,
Kanchi Dasa

_________________
NAMAH SHIVAYA-JAYA JAYA SHANKARA-HARA HARA SHANKARA

[kanchi_dasa]

Dear Naathigan-ji,

Sorry, you have already mentioned.

With Ever Warmest Regards,
Kanchi Dasa

_________________
NAMAH SHIVAYA-JAYA JAYA SHANKARA-HARA HARA SHANKARA

[anushachennai]

Dear Sri Kanchidasa

As Sri Naathigan had quoted verses from Bhagavatpada, I was hesitant to post a view that was contrary even in as academic as this view. After days of brooding over, I decided to seek the clarification. I had the hope that the relevant verse could lend itself to a different interpretation on a closer scrutiny and reading by those adept at Sanskrit. but it seems that Bhagavat Pada was clear on this score and I shall accept it, but Tirumoolar and Kaamika agama differ on this score. May be at a later date the Sadashiva will show us the reasons for each view.

[Anbu]

Nadis: Ida Nadis And Pingala Nadis
By Sri Swami Sivananda

Ida and Pingala Nadis are not the gross sympathetic chains. These are the subtle Nadis that carry the Sukshma Prana. In the physical body these tentatively correspond to the right and left sympathetic chains.

Ida starts from the right tessticle and Pingala from the left tessticle. They meet with Sushumna Nadi at the Muladhara Chakra and make a knot there. This junction of three Nadis at the Muladhara Chakra is known as Mukta Triveni. Ganga, Yamuna and Sarasvati dwell in Pingala, Ida and Sushumna Nadis respectively. This meeting place is called Brahma Granthi. Again these meet at the Anahata and Ajna Chakra. In the macrocosm also you have a Triveni at Prayag where the three rivers Ganga, Yamuna and Sarasvati meet.

Ida flows through the left nostril and Pingala through the right nostril. Ida is also called Chandra Nadi (moon) and Pingala as Surya Nadi (sun). Ida is cooling and Pingala is heating. Pingala digests the food. Ida is of pale, Sakti Rupa. It is the great nourisher of the world. Pingala is of fiery red, Rudra Rupa. Ida and Pingala indicate Kala (time) and Sushumna swallows time. The Yogi knows the time of his death; takes his Prana into Sushumna; keeps it in Brahmarandra, and defies time (Kala?death). The famous Yogi Sri Chang Dev of Maharashtra fought against death several times by taking the Prana into Sushumna. He was a contemporary of Sri Jnanadev of Alandi, near Poona. It was he who had Bhuta Siddhi, control over wild animals, through his Yogic practices. He came on the back of a tiger to see Sri Jnanadev.

_________________
Sri Gurubyo Namaha

[kanchi_dasa]

Dear all,

The earthquake in Taiwan has very badly damaged the cables and has affected Telecommunications very badly. I am living in Singapore and my computer is one of the several thousands affected. I had wanted to post lot of new articles on Thirumandhiram, but due to unfortunate circumstances, I am unable to use the Internet completely. So, I will be off for about 2-3 weeks as the Papers say that it will take that much amount of time to repair the cables. The Papers say that quality will improve day by day. So I will be optimistic and if I can access Kanchiforum at any point of time, I will start posting. Please continue the discussions and keep this thread active and running.

With Ever Warmest Regards,
Kanchi Dasa

_________________
NAMAH SHIVAYA-JAYA JAYA SHANKARA-HARA HARA SHANKARA

[kanchi_dasa]

Dear all,

Thank God that I am able to use internet now without any problems.

Dear AC-ji,

You mentioned that Kaamika Agama mentions Manipura as fire and Svadishtana as water. That is fine; however, you also mentioned that Thirumoolar holds the same opinion. If so, where? By the way, I got my hands on this website which offers a Tamil translation of the Kaamika Agama and 2 other agamic texts. This magnificent work was painstakingly done by a Sivaachaariyaar. Go to this wonderful link: www.himalayanacademy.com/resources/books/agamas/

With Ever Warmest Regards,
Kanchi Dasa

_________________
NAMAH SHIVAYA-JAYA JAYA SHANKARA-HARA HARA SHANKARA

[anushachennai]

Dear Sri Kanchidasa

Namaskarams

I just am wondering as to how the Yogis of the yore would have / would classify the internet cables ? Ida or Pingala or Sushumna Nadi ?

In lighter vein. (Oh, vein could be classified in to a Nadi too!)

On serious track.

I had been to have darshan of the Sadashiva Yantra and the Lord who presides this Universe in the Yantra on the eve of the Gregorian New Year and prayed for the welfare and peace in the Universe. Was therefore away from the forum for a while.

Thanks for the links to the Agamas. They will educate and enlighten me.